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Poster: William Tell Date: Apr 26, 2007 1:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

It is truly astounding that these naysayers and conspiricist zealots so readily latch onto literally "National Enquirer" based rumors as to supposedly irrefutable databases to support their positions...as a working university scientist I can tell you that atmospheric scientists are in universal agreement on this, and the databases from multiple and independent sources confirm it.

Those that speak against global warming are absolutely no different from those that argue the Earth is flat. Or that evolution is just a theory.

Amazing what folks will buy into.

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Poster: Chris Freedom Date: Apr 26, 2007 2:05pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Hey, Who says the Earth is not flat? I have a few 'Yes' albums that clearly and very cosmically show the earth is most definitely flat. What more proof do I need than that?

As for Global warming , Jeez if an ice cap the size of Rhode Island just fell into the ocean what's the big deal?

So what if there is no solid ice anymore in places that have had solid ice for as long as anyone can remember?

What is the big deal if Winter now starts in February and runs until early April?

"I heard a voice telling me to flee, the very same voice I always believed, said, a lot of trouble is coming , but it don't have to come to you"

Why would you want to trust scientists who study climate when you can take the word of a guy who used to live almost exclusively on slabs of MEAT.


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Poster: William Tell Date: Apr 26, 2007 2:39pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

I stand corrected. With a name like Freedom I should have known you would help me see the American Way.

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Poster: ghostofpig Date: Apr 26, 2007 3:17pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

I dunno, W.T., I fell off the edge of the world more than once in the sixties!

We may emit only 4% of those hydrocarbons--but if only .5% is in your town--smog alert. Atlanta has an average of 55 days over the limit per summer.
Fish losses? Coral bleaching and death in the Pacific? Other species?
It's not just the destruction of the Amazon.

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Poster: Chris Freedom Date: Apr 26, 2007 5:12pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Hey William Tell

That was sarcasm!

p.s. "No ,chicken little running from a falling sky"

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Poster: William Tell Date: Apr 26, 2007 5:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

I know Chris; your secret is safe with me. Freedom forever, for one and all!

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Poster: Chris Freedom Date: Apr 26, 2007 5:37pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

"Freedom, liberty, I got to find my own way home"

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: Apr 26, 2007 3:49pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

"All kinds of measurements from satellite agree in broad detail with charts patched together from accounts of shorter voyages, but seeing is believing and I don't mean seeing the lay of the land from the air in a flying machine. Have you ever noticed that the oceans and the Great Lakes appear motionless from the air? You can see waves but they seem frozen. This is a verifiable fact as anyone flying over big bodies of water can attest. Why is nothing ever said of it? Because it goes to show that what is real up close is something else altogether from a distance. So by what right do we extrapolate the Earth is a ball on patchwork evidence? Maybe it's convincing to some, but others are not so easily taken in.

Might I just point out that in our journey we saw not a hint of curvature? The horizon, you say? Why does it just seem to drop off if there's no curvature? Why not, with equal justice, assume that the Earth is a Mobius strip?

Are we laughed at? Of course. Scorn is the first and last refuge of the benighted. Round-Earthers are the worst of the lot but Flat-Earthers are not much better. We Unknown-Earthers get it from both sides. Takes guts. Takes vision and determination. Takes a sense of humor.

One morning near the beginning of our voyage, during sunrise in Antarctica, my squad and I saw a very rare sight. We saw a pair of wings extending from horizon to horizon and probably beyond because you couldn't see the tips, only the vast pinions. And they were gently flapping. The Sun rose portside and we were flying directly toward it, veering slightly to the West as it rose higher. After awhile the sunlight got too bright to see the wings anymore, though they did not seem in the least ephemeral at dawn.

I am not going to come right out and say that Earth is a bird. But I'm going to suggest it strongly. Yes, we took pictures and, no, they did not come out. Taking 180 degree pictures at dawn is tricky business. We'd have needed to prepare in advance and how do you prepare for something like that? Story of science. I understand that repeatability is necessary to establish scientifically acceptable fact, and I appreciate this, but what if the truth is a one-off deal? Something that doesn't stir itself to show at your beck and call? It's my surmise that the angle and spectrum of visible sunlight, the temperature, and the subdued intensity of early morning chroma conspired to show something which is generally beyond seeing. Were the sighting not unique, it seems it would be mentioned somewhere in the literature of sea and sky."

Excerpt form 'Curvature' a short story by Robert Hunter 8.4.2006

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Poster: high flow Date: Apr 26, 2007 3:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Knew I read that somewhere before. I believe Dr Flashback turned me on to Hunter's journal of short stories...cool stuff.

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: Apr 26, 2007 4:46pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Hi High
I give AshesRising credit for pointing me to his short stories. A joy to read.
But I really just wanted to say that its moot whether there would be a grateful dead as we know it if not for Mr Stanley III - with its wider implications. I for one still regard Owsley as part of the gd family and I admire and respect his contributions, so I will listen to his views with an open mind as I will anyone who has something pertinent to say. I'm not very good at writing this kind of stuff, I feel a bit pompous, but I thought I had to say something.

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Poster: Chris Freedom Date: Apr 26, 2007 4:56pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Hey Jerrob

Not meaning to put Owsley down just not who i would turn to when studying climatology.

While I am pretty sure that we are messing with the planet's self regulating mechanisms I am also pretty sure that we are not going to alter the planet beyond perhaps causing misery for ourselves and the other inhabitants of terra firma.

To me being a good steward of the eath is very important. It seems like there has got to be ways to both protect the environment and provide for all of it's inhabitants.

I sure would like to see us use more of what has been freely given such as solar & wind. I am aware that we will still need fossil fuels but there has been minimal effort to develop these renewable resources. Many of us will be priced out of buying gasoline in ten years if prices continue to rise at current rates.

When President Bush took office gas was around $1.50 a gallon. Now it is in the $3.00 range. Oil profits are at record highs what is the market incentive to pursue alternative fuels?

"And the rich man in his summer home"

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Poster: bigbossdan Date: Apr 26, 2007 5:26pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

The incentive is the long-term viability of corporations like Exxon-Mobil, BP-Amoco and others. They aren't building new refineries because they know it isn't worth the billion dollar investment, there won't be enough crude to justify the construction. The supply of oil won't be worth the blood and iron that will be shed to protect it. Alternitive fuels are going to have to take precedent. But even more than that, we will have to rethink the "need" for every household to have one, two, three more vehicles. In my view, gas prices aren't high enough yet. They have to rise to the point where society begins to change its behavior, demand better public transportation, demand planning and development that is friendly to foot and cycle traffic, transport of goods by rail and water, rather than trucks. Then we will start to move in the direction of cleaner air, sustainable energy use, and connected communities. As long as everyone is still in their own cars, in their own world, this will never happen.

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: Apr 26, 2007 5:37pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Global warming, greenhouse gases, the whole climate debate is a huge subject and eminent scientists have been vilified for daring to question the climate change hysteria, which has taken over from the last big scary thing and which some folks are making a load of money from and I'm just a poor dumb sod with a family to support struggling to find another job after the company I worked for went bust. (whew!) So I'm just trying look on the bright side of life tum te-dum te-dum

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Poster: midnight sun Date: Apr 27, 2007 11:06am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Jerrob:

Canada recently announced legislation to phase in a ban of manufacture and sale of incandescent light bulbs, a move that will cut their green house gas emissions by 1%...not bad considering their goal is 20%...one relatively simple and easy solution implemented and only 19 more to go

Where’s the hysteria?

sometimes it is difficult to know where you are coming from, but if you, or someone you know is so unfortunate as to be unhappily unemployed, why not invest your future with a company on the cutting edge of the lighting industry?

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Poster: high flow Date: Apr 26, 2007 3:06pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Owsley On The Environment

Evolution is no theory, it's god's devine creation. Duh!